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	<title>Comments on: Cross that one off</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos</link>
	<description>For graphic designers and all who love logos.</description>
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		<title>By: andy</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-15156</link>
		<dc:creator>andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 04:52:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-15156</guid>
		<description>It is deeply disturbing to the SWISS seeing the Swiss National Emblem in front of a good many medical institutions in the US or on the backs of
rescuers etc. While the Americans fully know and acknowledge the origin of the RedCross symbol, the erroneous use of the Swiss National emblem seems to express the ignorance of the users.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is deeply disturbing to the SWISS seeing the Swiss National Emblem in front of a good many medical institutions in the US or on the backs of<br />
rescuers etc. While the Americans fully know and acknowledge the origin of the RedCross symbol, the erroneous use of the Swiss National emblem seems to express the ignorance of the users.</p>
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		<title>By: Stina Sanchez</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-12282</link>
		<dc:creator>Stina Sanchez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Mar 2010 13:01:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-12282</guid>
		<description>You asked about flags and copyright and here are my thoughts on the subject.

National flags are rarely protected by copyright as most are too old for copyrights to apply. The original authors of the Tricolore, the Stars and Stripes and the Union Jack are long dead and their work are in the public domain copyright-wise.

However there are trademark concerns around the use of national flags in logos. According to article 6 c in the Paris Convention on the Protection of Industrial Property a trademark cannot be registered if it contains &quot;armorial bearings, flags, and other State emblems, of the countries of the Union, official signs and hallmarks indicating control and warranty adopted by them, and any imitation from a heraldic point of view&quot;.

I know most about the practice of the Danish Patent and Trademark Office. They will only register trademarks using the Danish flag as long as the trademark is intended for use of products of Danish origin as as well as they will only register trademarks using the civil flag - a special government permission is needed for registration of trademarks using the Danish state flag.

Trademarks using foreign flags will not be registered unless they are already registered in the country of the foreign flag, or unless that state has given permission.

Furthermore the flags used in a trademark has to have a connection to the products or services offered so that consumers will not be given a false impression of the geographical origin of the product.

However there are other uses that are permissible. For instance using the colours of a flag is not the same as using the flag. While it might be difficult to get the Stars and Stripes registered for use on a product produced elsewhere it is completely legitimate to create a red, white and blue trademark for that product.

Rules regarding the use of national flags vary from country to country and it would be wise to check out the legislation and contacting the relevant authorities before using the flag of a country.

Furthermore one should be careful using flags. Special legislation might protect them in addition to copyright and trademark law. For instance you need permission from the police to fly a foreign flag in public in Denmark.

So before using flags in a design one should be careful to check the relevant legislation.

Similar rules can apply to regional, local and ethnic flags. However the picture is more muddled here. While some regional flags enjoy an official status, others are just cultural symbols with no official sanction. If those unofficial flags are in the public domain because the copyright has either expired or has been relinquished they are free to use as well as any other public domain symbol.

Regarding flags of private organisations and companies the rule of thumb is to leave them alone unless you have permission from the organisation. These flags will often be of such recent date that copyright still applies and the flags and the symbols used in them will often be trademarks of the organisation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You asked about flags and copyright and here are my thoughts on the subject.</p>
<p>National flags are rarely protected by copyright as most are too old for copyrights to apply. The original authors of the Tricolore, the Stars and Stripes and the Union Jack are long dead and their work are in the public domain copyright-wise.</p>
<p>However there are trademark concerns around the use of national flags in logos. According to article 6 c in the Paris Convention on the Protection of Industrial Property a trademark cannot be registered if it contains &#8220;armorial bearings, flags, and other State emblems, of the countries of the Union, official signs and hallmarks indicating control and warranty adopted by them, and any imitation from a heraldic point of view&#8221;.</p>
<p>I know most about the practice of the Danish Patent and Trademark Office. They will only register trademarks using the Danish flag as long as the trademark is intended for use of products of Danish origin as as well as they will only register trademarks using the civil flag &#8211; a special government permission is needed for registration of trademarks using the Danish state flag.</p>
<p>Trademarks using foreign flags will not be registered unless they are already registered in the country of the foreign flag, or unless that state has given permission.</p>
<p>Furthermore the flags used in a trademark has to have a connection to the products or services offered so that consumers will not be given a false impression of the geographical origin of the product.</p>
<p>However there are other uses that are permissible. For instance using the colours of a flag is not the same as using the flag. While it might be difficult to get the Stars and Stripes registered for use on a product produced elsewhere it is completely legitimate to create a red, white and blue trademark for that product.</p>
<p>Rules regarding the use of national flags vary from country to country and it would be wise to check out the legislation and contacting the relevant authorities before using the flag of a country.</p>
<p>Furthermore one should be careful using flags. Special legislation might protect them in addition to copyright and trademark law. For instance you need permission from the police to fly a foreign flag in public in Denmark.</p>
<p>So before using flags in a design one should be careful to check the relevant legislation.</p>
<p>Similar rules can apply to regional, local and ethnic flags. However the picture is more muddled here. While some regional flags enjoy an official status, others are just cultural symbols with no official sanction. If those unofficial flags are in the public domain because the copyright has either expired or has been relinquished they are free to use as well as any other public domain symbol.</p>
<p>Regarding flags of private organisations and companies the rule of thumb is to leave them alone unless you have permission from the organisation. These flags will often be of such recent date that copyright still applies and the flags and the symbols used in them will often be trademarks of the organisation.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex P</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-12050</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Mar 2010 06:32:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-12050</guid>
		<description>I was just going to post something about the International Red Cross relations, but then saw Yves has already done that.

One thing I do want to add is that this short version of a cross (like the Swiss flag), after being promoted by the International Red Cross movement, has completely lost its religious meaning in some part of the world. I am thinking how in China the symbol now acts purely as an emblem or a sign for medicine. This happens when you put a cruciform sign in a place where Christianity is more-or-less unheard of. It has nothing to do with Churches opening hospitals or Christianity&#039;s identification with health care; the semiotics behind the cross purely came from the Red Cross movement.

By the way, somehow Chinese have decided to adopt a modified version of the cross. The colors were reversed, making it look like a Swiss flag, but not exactly Swiss because the cross isn&#039;t framed in a square or rectangle. Instead they made up this flower-like frame, kind of like a red cloverleaf, with a white cross in the middle. Don&#039;t know why.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was just going to post something about the International Red Cross relations, but then saw Yves has already done that.</p>
<p>One thing I do want to add is that this short version of a cross (like the Swiss flag), after being promoted by the International Red Cross movement, has completely lost its religious meaning in some part of the world. I am thinking how in China the symbol now acts purely as an emblem or a sign for medicine. This happens when you put a cruciform sign in a place where Christianity is more-or-less unheard of. It has nothing to do with Churches opening hospitals or Christianity&#8217;s identification with health care; the semiotics behind the cross purely came from the Red Cross movement.</p>
<p>By the way, somehow Chinese have decided to adopt a modified version of the cross. The colors were reversed, making it look like a Swiss flag, but not exactly Swiss because the cross isn&#8217;t framed in a square or rectangle. Instead they made up this flower-like frame, kind of like a red cloverleaf, with a white cross in the middle. Don&#8217;t know why.</p>
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		<title>By: David Airey</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-7269</link>
		<dc:creator>David Airey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Aug 2009 10:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-7269</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a fair assessment, Ash. I agree.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s a fair assessment, Ash. I agree.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ash</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-7164</link>
		<dc:creator>Ash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Aug 2009 16:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-7164</guid>
		<description>While I DO think that the cross has been overused in design, especially lately with minimalism being all the rage, I think things like the cross and the circle are non-unique enough that they can be a much-repeated base for designs. Of course, I say base, which means a designer must then inject meaning and individuality into them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I DO think that the cross has been overused in design, especially lately with minimalism being all the rage, I think things like the cross and the circle are non-unique enough that they can be a much-repeated base for designs. Of course, I say base, which means a designer must then inject meaning and individuality into them.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Merrick</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-6602</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Merrick</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Jun 2009 17:24:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-6602</guid>
		<description>As a kid I used to confuse SwissAir, The Red Cross and Churches in general....not much has changed !

Tim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a kid I used to confuse SwissAir, The Red Cross and Churches in general&#8230;.not much has changed !</p>
<p>Tim</p>
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		<title>By: David Airey</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-6482</link>
		<dc:creator>David Airey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 31 May 2009 22:44:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-6482</guid>
		<description>Thanks very much to all who commented. I took a two-week break just after publishing this post, so excuse my delayed reply.

Roberta,

The Johnson &amp; Johnson issue with the Red Cross is an interesting one, and I touched upon it in my original &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.logodesignlove.com/international-red-cross-logo-design&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Red Cross logo post&lt;/a&gt;.

Tjeerd,

No need to apologise at all. I&#039;m sure you have much more important things on your plate.

Andrew,

There&#039;s certainly another article on what you mention (symbols becoming logos and vice versa). If you choose to work on it, I look forward to that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks very much to all who commented. I took a two-week break just after publishing this post, so excuse my delayed reply.</p>
<p>Roberta,</p>
<p>The Johnson &#038; Johnson issue with the Red Cross is an interesting one, and I touched upon it in my original <a href="http://www.logodesignlove.com/international-red-cross-logo-design" rel="nofollow">Red Cross logo post</a>.</p>
<p>Tjeerd,</p>
<p>No need to apologise at all. I&#8217;m sure you have much more important things on your plate.</p>
<p>Andrew,</p>
<p>There&#8217;s certainly another article on what you mention (symbols becoming logos and vice versa). If you choose to work on it, I look forward to that.</p>
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		<title>By: Roberta Seldon</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-6464</link>
		<dc:creator>Roberta Seldon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 May 2009 15:46:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-6464</guid>
		<description>David,

Don&#039;t forget about the Johnson &amp; Johnson cross. They had been going back and forth with the American Red Cross for quite some time about their use of the red cross. They actually sued them. You can read more about that here: http://www.jnj.com/connect/news/corporate/20080617_160000

Great post btw :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David,</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t forget about the Johnson &#038; Johnson cross. They had been going back and forth with the American Red Cross for quite some time about their use of the red cross. They actually sued them. You can read more about that here: <a href="http://www.jnj.com/connect/news/corporate/20080617_160000" rel="nofollow">http://www.jnj.com/connect/news/corporate/20080617_160000</a></p>
<p>Great post btw :-)</p>
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		<title>By: Richard, Peacock Carter Newcastle</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-6367</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard, Peacock Carter Newcastle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 19:56:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-6367</guid>
		<description>I particularly like the Film Aid logo, though I&#039;ve never been keen on the Bayer logo - always looks awkward in my eyes!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I particularly like the Film Aid logo, though I&#8217;ve never been keen on the Bayer logo &#8211; always looks awkward in my eyes!</p>
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		<title>By: Media Designer</title>
		<link>http://www.logodesignlove.com/cross-logos/comment-page-1#comment-6364</link>
		<dc:creator>Media Designer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 06:44:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.logodesignlove.com/?p=218#comment-6364</guid>
		<description>I love these theme posts! Following themes is a great way to look at design  - things to avoid and things to include.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love these theme posts! Following themes is a great way to look at design  &#8211; things to avoid and things to include.</p>
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